r/BitchEatingCrafters • u/Dry-Conversation2646 • 1d ago
Sewing It is like pattern creators doesn't get how elastics work
Yeah, I'm probably unreasonable but I've had three glasses of wine so fuck it.
I am a fat person. I acknowledge that. It is one of the many, *many* reasons I choose to create my own clothes.
Many of the trousers for fat people incorporates some kind of waistband elastic, either full waistband or partial waistband. I fucking hate waistband elastics. They gather the fabric and make my already corpulent waist look, if possible, even wider and directly erases any whispers of a hourglass figure.
But, I'm not an impossible woman. Oh no. If so many popular pattern has it, and som many people swear by it, I atleast should give it a chance, right? RIGHT? So, I settle on waistband with elastics in the back. Jones trousers by Goldfinch. I sew them. I'm about to add the elastic part, when the pattern states:
"Cut an elastic about the half width of your waist plus 2,5 cm"
I'm sorry, what? Do you guys know what happens with elastic that are exactly so long it needs to be in a relaxed state? It *drumrolls* STRETCHES TOO LONG.
Which means, there are no way in hell it will keep my pants up. BUT, since I'm not an impossible woman, I try. Lo and behold, whos pants does not stay up? You wanna guess??
I rip up the aggravating waistband, shorten the elastic by 25% and tries again. There, better. Now they don't fall of when standing still, atleast.
But after a day at work, the back still falls and looks like a kindergardeners jogging pants from the back.
So I go through my patterns. Pattern after pattern states to CUT THE ELASTIC THE EXACT LENGTH AS THE WAIST (or half the waist in case of back elastic waistbands). What am I doing wrong? Or what are pattern writers explanation for this? Is this a plus size thing? Like, plus size patterns need a different amount of ease, and different length of elastic kinda thing?
Anyhow, I'm now furious with elastic, who should be my best friend but turnes out to be a backstabbing bitch.
Peace!
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u/skunk-ray 1d ago
I have never in my life listened to elastic length recommendations because there are too many variables - there's stiffer and softer elastics thet influence how tight I want them to sit against my stomach, sometimes the fabric I pick has some stretch to it etc.
2nd gripe I have as another fat woman is wide elastic IT ALWAYS BUCKLES IN THE MIDDLE!
Re: patterns that ask for exactly the waistband measurements - that is still bonkers!
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u/TomNookSuperfan 1d ago
When a pattern calls for wide elastic I will sometimes sew a channel and use 2 strips of half the called for width, which can solve the buckling issue
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u/blue19255 1d ago
This is all true! Better to hold the elastic to your body. Also better to use the common sense method for cuffs and necklines in knits. Too many variables in the fabric to trust any pattern.
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u/Capable_Sea77 21h ago
I've found using wide plush elastic (it's a little more expensive, but it's used for lingerie straps and bands) for a waistband minimizes the buckling in the middle. Since it is thicker than regular elastic, you do want to check how snug the elastic is in the waistband channel - I've had to add maybe a centimeter when it's a super snug fit.
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u/shinpibubble 23h ago
I got a free pattern for the kids when they were little and the pattern came with an elastic test! Cut x amount and stretch it and see which line it stretches to and cut the elastic for the pants according to the stretch 😍
Yeah waist plus something is a puddle around your ankles.
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u/ej_21 1d ago
I have made the Jones trousers (and many others). Generally you are told to cut the elastic to full width BECAUSE that is the longest possible length of elastic anyone could need. You’re then meant to try them on, adjust the elastic until the waist is to your exact preference, then cut off the excess/finish the waist.
In fact, I just pulled out the Jones instructions, and right there in a special callout square are the words: “Now try on your pants and adjust length of elastic as needed.”
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u/ej_21 1d ago
From a few other popular patterns:
Bob Woven Pant — “Cut the elastic to your personal length.”
Arthur Pants — “This is a good time to try on your pants - if you want to tighten the elastic, now is your chance!” and “you can adjust the [elastic] length as desired when you’re trying on the pants. You can always cinch it up from there, but increase the length by too much and you’ll find yourself having to hike up your pants!”
Carolyn Pajamas — “Once it's all the way through, try your pants on to determine how snug you would like your elastic. Trim the elastic to the appropriate length, leaving 1.5" (38mm) to overlap the ends.”
etc. etc.
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u/Dry-Conversation2646 1d ago
It is actually not a part of the instructions - it is an advice in a hint box. A quite redundant at that - I know I'm allowed to alter patterns as I see fit. Which I also did.
I also do not have a single clue how elastic waistbands will behave after and during wear, which is why CuT tO YOur owN pERsoNaL prEFeReNCE is worthless "advice" or "instruction". No, there wont be a one solution fits all-kinda thing. I still get to be annoyed.
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u/ej_21 17h ago
Sure, this is BEC, of course you have the right to be annoyed. But this is also a perfectly normal sewing pattern thing. If you’re looking for a deeper dive into how elastic behaves, or how to get a better personal fit, that’s more something to get from a class and/or blog and/or personal experience.
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u/CBG1955 1d ago
I also am a fat woman. I use elastic. I NEVER measure it - I take the elastic, wrap it around my middle, and when it's comfortable, that's the right length.
If you only need elastic at the back - get a HUGE safety pin, like a nappy pin (diaper), put on one end. Thread elastic through, stitch securely on the end without the pin. Try on item inside out. Pull the pin until the elastic feels right, then stitch. Tuck ends of casing in, whipstitch closed.
Sometimes though, elastic is simply shit. Pull it before you use it. Does it recover evenly along the edges? if it's crooked or wonky, it's starting to perish. There are multiple kinds - woven, braided, or knitted. Here's an explanation, hope this helps
Disclaimer: I have 60+ years' sewing experience, and eff me, only thought about this a few years ago. only once has it not worked, and that was only because the too-soft elastic and too heavy knit skirt were incompatible.
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u/justchelsea1 1d ago
Are you stretching out your elastic before cutting it? Pull it as hard as you can a few times and you'll see how much it grows. But for a waistband the patten should really include instructions for that.
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u/stormysees 1d ago
When plus size patterns are not tech edited or tested by plus sized humans. You cannot simply make things proportionally larger and expect it to fit the same. The more elastic you have, the more it will stretch. This happens with bra fitting, too. Someone with a very small rib cage might actually need a bra with more stretch or a size just slightly larger than a tight measurement because there isn’t enough elastic to stretch and allow them to move comfortably. A plus sized body with more squish over the ribs needs the opposite. Their tight band measurement might still feel a bit unsupportive because there’s so much elastic in the band that it can stretch more than needed to provide support. So a size down, provided it doesn’t distort the underwire, is often the fix. The more elastic in the system, the more stretch you have.
I knit but this problem exists in plus sized patterns in knitting, too. Constant patterns that say they accommodate up to a bust size of X inches/cm but the pattern hasn’t actually been graded for a body that size in other ways, so yeah, the final garment is that width but it looks dumpy because the shape is entirely incorrect compared to the original model. I try new pattern makers occasionally, if i see plus sized models in their images, but mostly i stick with the ones i know have intensive tech editing and test knitting done before publishing.
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u/Cassandracork 1d ago
And all of this is why I haven’t knit or sewn any garments in months. I have always been big but my proportions have recently shifted outside of “standard” grading. I have hit the wall on my adjustments skills I can teach myself alone and everything fits awful, even patterns allegedly graded for plus. And I am lucky to have grown up learning this stuff from family. At least with RTW if it doesn’t fit I didn’t spend hours of my life and hundreds on supplies to get there. /whine
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u/Tara1994 1d ago
I know you haven’t asked for it, but I’m a fan of cashmerette and Helen’s closet for patterns. Both of their patterns are good for plus sized people, and cashmerette in particular has a couple of books about sewing for plus sized bodies, and how to grade it so it works for you.
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u/witteefool 1d ago
I was going to say— Cashmerette has this on lock, particularly the elastic waistbands.
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u/Cassandracork 1d ago
It’s probably time to circle back to Cashmerette. I haven’t because the patterns are generally not my style, but I know she has general alterations resources. I just wish there were more in person options, as that is part of what is so difficult for me personally.
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u/seaintosky 1d ago
Muna and Broad also. Their style is distinctive, and not for everyone, but their drafting is top notch and done by someone who literally wrote a textbook on plus size drafting. They also have multiple pattern pieces for different body shapes rather than a single block.
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u/isthisirc 1d ago
I don’t know about Helen’s closet for pants; I had to make so many adjustments to the Yantas that nothing of the original pattern was unaltered (and I’ve heard other people complain about the same thing, so it’s not just my body that is too nonstandard). But her tops are awesome!
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u/Tara1994 1d ago
I haven’t attempted to make any pants yet so I’ll keep that in mind if I try them!
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u/lyralady 1d ago
Someone with a very small rib cage might actually need a bra with more stretch or a size just slightly larger than a tight measurement because there isn’t enough elastic to stretch and allow them to move comfortably.
Thank you, this explains SO MUCH!! I'm usually an "xs" size in everything but for built in bras, bralettes, or wireless bras without number sizing, I often buy the smalls because the bands have no stretch whatsoever and it hurts to wear and will leave terrible red marks in my skin. Even if the measurement charts say I should wear the XS size, it usually doesn't work and I was starting to think my ribcage was perhaps a tiny bit deformed or something. I even once bought a specialty bra based on my "true" size with proper measuring based on reddit advice or whatever and it was even worse lol.
I feel a little clueless but yeah, haha. That makes so much more sense. Sometimes I also size up if the true waist of something is elastic and the measurements are supposed to fit me, because the compression is so bad.
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u/hadesarrow3 1d ago
It took me decades to find a sports bra I could tolerate for exactly this reason. I still don’t understand the mechanics of why most sports bras especially are so effing tight on the ribcage. I don’t feel like that blood-restricting squeeze actually does a whole lot to help with support??? I don’t know, maybe I just don’t know enough about bras.
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u/naughtscrossstitches 1d ago
The only way I found a sports bra that worked was to double up two bras. That way they didn't squeeze me painfully but I was actually supported.
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u/stormysees 1d ago
I wouldn’t write off all bras in a properly measured size simply because one brand didn’t fit. Shape has a lot to do with bra fitting as can the dyes used, it’s like jeans or shoes. Anything close fitting can take a lot of trial and error and vary a bit brand to brand. A brand might be known for having shallow cups which will fit some people well but make others feel suffocatingly tight, or have a band so stretchy it causes chafing. But it’s not that uncommon to have someone who measures a tight 28” band feel more comfortable in a 30” bra. Similarly, someone with a tight 42” underbust might be wearing a 38” bra in a known stretchy brand and say “yeah, I know I’m technically over stretching the band but I’m not getting the support i like in this particular bra in a larger band, smaller cup.” They’re guidelines, not rules. Bodies are curves and none are exactly the same.
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u/lyralady 1d ago edited 1d ago
I didn't write off "all bras in a properly measured size" per se, it's just that letter cup size bras in my exact "properly measured size" are an expensive specialty size to even try out whereas I can simply buy a soft/wireless bra in size small and be fine, or sometimes buy a sister size (32A/AA) that is at least able to be found in stores and may adjust to fit comfortably. (I also realize I said "a bra" but now that I looked back at it, it was a trial set of a few different bras in different styles and I think one other size? But like, this would've been like 2014 so it's been awhile since then, lol).
Most of my bras are now either Uniqlo or Subset size small, which doesn't really have firm/moulded cups. And Uniqlo is because they have bras with a longer number of hook rows (I think like, 6 sometimes?), making it easier to adjust the band up or down as is comfortable. But yeah I have a lot of soft cup bras/bralettes and so focus less on the standard cup measurements now than I used to because I found what I liked without it.
Same with sports bras — I get the small because I hate super tight constriction around my ribs even though I am usually the XS on a size chart. I didn't put it together I'm not stretching out the elastic enough to be comfortable otherwise.
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u/stormysees 1d ago
If you’re comfortable, then it’s all good! I’m on the other side of the bra spectrum and there is no such thing as a comfortable soft cup bralette to me. I love a good sturdy underwire and a firm band but I’m very particular about the way the cups fit (and most brands do not fit well for me).
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u/lyralady 22h ago
Totally get it! My mom is on the other side of the bra and size spectrum, and I've been bra shopping with her more than a few times in my life. Honestly if you had any good brand recommendations that aren't Torrid/Lane Bryant i'd love to know. My mom almost never buys herself nice/new clothes or things, and she's allergic to metal (no jewelry) and aloe vera (in basically most body/skin care stuff), so that could be a good gift card idea for her.
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u/Sundae_2004 15h ago
Have you heard of Shefit? https://shefit.com.
N.B.: You must measure your dimensions because the sizing is different. E.g., I’m 2 Crowns which isn’t a direct equivalent to my usual number LT. What I like about these is (especially in the Ultimate Sports bra) that you have three Velcro adjustments that are the full size of each (one for each side and the middle) and you can revise any/all if you’ve plumped or slimmed down. Too, the Ultimate allows you to remove/insert padding if you’re less endowed on a particular side. ;)
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u/stormysees 21h ago
Most of my well fitting bras are Panache. I’d suggest finding a local bra retailer, not a box store, and make a fun date day of it. Get brunch, schedule a proper bra fitting at a real bra shop, buy a $60 bra that actually fits well. If you really don’t have a bra specialty shop in driving distance, Nordstroms is usually the best of the big stores for bra fitting and they carry European brands. It’s not that American brands are bad per se, it’s that the sizing is wildly inconsistent and the shape tends to be very shallow, molded foam cups, which just doesn’t work for most people.
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u/hadesarrow3 23h ago
If you’re interested in trying more of an undershirt style, Happy Earth has a reversible half-tank (or crop tank? I can’t remember which it’s called) that is my go-to “bra” now. The bottom band is extremely wide and not at all constricting. The downside is that I’m not sure the xs will be small enough for you… I wear their sports bra in an xl for comfort, but their tank top (the one I prefer to use as a bra!) in a medium because it’s so lightweight and stretchy.
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u/lyralady 22h ago
I've tried their leggings! According to the size chart, I ordered an XS...and I wish I had ordered a small even though I can tell the XS fits correctly. Genuinely might also be some skin sensitivity/sensory issues from ADHD and my skin being really sensitive to pressure. I once had a dermatographia flare as a teen and while it's never been that bad again (I could lightly run a nail over my skin and I would welt in that line, so naturally I played tic tac toe at the doctor's) I can still get red lines just from like, seams and pressure haha.
Anyways I'll try them! I've been meaning to anyways. I loved their crop tops.
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u/hadesarrow3 22h ago
That’s fair, I have sensory issues as well, which is why I love this company… the active wear is so much softer and more breathable than most bras. It’s the same material as the leggings, but squeezing shouldn’t be an issue with the tank. The leggings are a really weird fit and I think they’re more like long underwear than pants. I’ve got some of their lounge pants that I adore. I find their hoodies a little too heavy which was a bummer because I love the look of them.
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u/lyralady 22h ago
I also love the lounge pants!! I'll definitely try it out I was gonna do another order from them anyways.
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u/hadesarrow3 21h ago
Their returns are also really easy, so I’d suggest ordering a few sizes so you can find the best fit. Good luck! Note: to be completely clear - I’m recommending the reversible tank crop top… not the sports bra or the full tank!
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u/generallyintoit 13h ago
It is unfortunately a matter of trying them on and cutting the elastic to fit. Lighter fabrics need less negative ease in the elastic and heavier needs more, to hold up the bulk. I followed a random Instagram tip of waist minus 2 inches, but I was using a floaty rayon and a 1.5 inch elastic so those pants are very sturdy on the waist! In a twill weight more appropriate for bottoms, I needed to take out elastic a few times before they really stayed up. It's so annoying because you're so close to the end
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u/insincere_platitudes 1d ago
See, I am one of the people that likes my elastic to MINIMALLY be my waist measurement. Elastic shrinks in the wash, and I've had way too many elastic waistband feel like they are cutting me in half after I wash them.
I do also find that topstitching elastic when you have to tug it to fit the waistband also tends to permanently stretch it out.
Basically, I had to freaking trial and error out how long I have to cut my preferred brand of elastic out so that it will be the size I want after topstitching and washing. So I just use that measurement for most waistbands I make.
I now fully ignore the pattern maker's elastic recommendations for the waistline and just use it as a jumping point for all other body parts...full stop. I personally can't stand fixed waistbands or hard pants, so I've just had to make it work.
But occasionally, I'm still seam ripping out elastic to fix the length after fully wearing and washing. And I loathe that with the passion of a thousand suns. But I prefer my elastics too big than small. Which is also why now I add drawstrings to anything that can aesthetically pull it off.
Correct elastic measurements are the bane of my existence.
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u/AdvancedSquashDirect 1d ago
My waist is like 130 cm on a good day... I just use the 90 cm packet of elastic every time. It's about a yard of elastic and it stretches to the perfect amount. I also don't use any of the elastics that say that they are for waistbands, those elastics are often too thick and too hard and they are really uncomfortable and painful. I just use the half inch soft elastic.
If it says take an elastic measure to your waist: I think they don't mean 130 cm, they mean take a piece of elastic and wrap it around your waist until it's comfortable and then add 2.5 cm for overlap so you can sew it.
It knows what the waist measurement of the garment is because it's a pattern so if it wanted you to use the waist measurement of the garment it would just tell you to use 130 cm of elastic (Or it would have an elastic template). But instead it's specifically says to measure it to your waist.
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u/ToKeepAndToHoldForev 1d ago
When I was first learning (read: I still am) how to make pants for work every guide on elastics claimed knit elastics should be cut to your waistband length (width?) minus an inch. In what world?
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u/otherpeoplesbones 22h ago
I've read that they should be cut to your waist size PLUS an inch which makes zero sense.
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u/Squirreltacular 17h ago
The plus is for overlap to stitch the ends together, but the base length is still unforgivable.
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u/otherpeoplesbones 15h ago
That overlap is huge! And yes, that base length makes zero sense. You need to let the elastic do it's job, which is to stretch and hold up your pants!
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u/Staff_Genie 1d ago
For a set of costume gathered skirts that were involved in a quick change, I used waistband of spandex that was the waist measurement, gather the skirt onto it and inserted an appropriate width of elastic. So the waistband would stretch to go over the hips and then spring back tight to the waist with no bulk
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u/SassyFerrets 15h ago
I have difficulty with the feel of elastic waistbands, no idea why. Usually if a pattern asks for one, I'll create a tie on waistband instead. If the fabric is thick, it looks a little wonky, but it works fine for thinner fabrics.
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u/pollypetunia 14h ago
What I'll often do is make the middle bit of the drawstring elastic (so like cut a shortish piece of elastic and then sew the drawstrings to either end of it before threading it through) which gives just enough leeway that I can get the trousers on and off without fully undoing the ties, but isn't as uncomfortable as a full elastic waist.
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u/SassyFerrets 9h ago
Oh this is a good idea! I'm making some pants right now, I'm going to try that!
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u/Cinisajoy2 1d ago
Now you have me trying to remember the elastic rule.
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u/TousBous 1d ago
For the pattern you quoted - are you cutting the elastic to half the WIDTH of you waist, or half the CIRCUMFERENCE? It sounds like you're describing circumference (all the way around - yeah, that's not going to work), but the quote says width. Measure straight across your front from one side to the other. Half that plus a bit (2.5 cm or in?) should get you pretty close to a snug half-waistband. Maybe a bit more or less depending on the fabric you're using and personal preference.
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u/hadesarrow3 1d ago
Holy crap that wouldn’t have occurred to me, but I’ll bet that’s what’s happening. OP, if the commenter here is right, don’t feel bad, I’d have done EXACTLY the same thing you did.
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u/Dry-Conversation2646 1d ago
The exact line in the pattern is: cut elastic to 1/2 of your waist measurement + 1 inch.
I assumed waist measurement referred to the measurement I used when picked out a size since they use the same term there but I'm not native to english - what do you think? Would that be half of my waist circumference or half my width?
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u/georgia_grace 1d ago
Waist measurement always means waist circumference.
I’ve never seen “waist width” as a term in a pattern nor have I ever seen pattern instructions saying to do what the commenter above described
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u/Remarkable-Let-750 1d ago
This is one reason I've started experimenting with maternity-style waistbands. I don't wear tucked in styles, so I'm fine with a knit band at the top of a skirt or pants, and it removes the BS of elastic bunching.
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u/SquareThings 1d ago
Measuring elastic is just impossible. Different brands and styles stretch a different amount and snap back with different strengths. They shrink or slacken in the wash. They wear differently. And everyone likes a different amount of tightness. One person’s “strangling me” is another’s “comforting squeeze.”
And yet pattern designers just confidently state a precise amount of elastic to be used, with no instructions on fitting and testing!
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u/SnailsAreGroovy 1d ago
One of the main problems you're going to run into is that you can only size something up so much before it starts completely failing and needs to be entirely reworked. This applies to pretty much everything. Shapes lose their structural integrity once they hit a certain size, and are put under a certain amount of stress.
Laying a two foot log of 1/2 foot diameter across a foot-wide stream will work as a bridge, and I would be confident crossing it without fear of it snapping. Laying a 30 foot log with a 1/2 foot diameter across a 29 foot river will not work as a bridge, and the log is much more likely to snap in the middle when I try to cross.
Sure you can use thicker logs for wider rivers, but at some point you have to ask yourself: why am I putting in all of this effort to find thick logs when I should be focusing on the structure of the makeshift bridge instead? Not to mention that eventually, the log bridge will need to be so thick that it'll collapse under its own weight. Add in enough angled supports at the edges, and enough triangular supports in the middle, and a 1/2 foot diameter log can span the whole ass river.
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u/Mrs_Tanqueray 6h ago
If working in inches for a pair of trousers I use the waistband measurement and deduct between 3 to 5 inches depending on the fabric and the elastic. And I thought everyone did that. The only time I might add a seam allowance to elastic is if I am using it to stabilise arm or leg holes on a leotard of swimsuit,
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u/blue19255 1d ago
You’re right that wouldn’t fit anybody, plus size or not. Always trust your gut with sewing! Patterns regularly suck.
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u/PurpleTiger6862 You should knit a fucking clue. 2h ago
I think you're confusing your hips and your waist. In the majority of women, your waist is narrower than your hips. So by cutting it to your wait measurement, it's comfortable to wear, but it gets "caught" so to speak, on your hips.
Of coursw, this does present challenges if your hips and waist are close together in size. In which case you'll need to reduce the length
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u/Dry-Conversation2646 1h ago
No, I do not confuse my hips and my waist. My hips are a good 15 inches larger than my waist measurement and I still can assure you that the elastic cut to waist measurement does not do its job.
I honestly do find this kind of condescending.
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u/PurpleTiger6862 You should knit a fucking clue. 1h ago
I wasn't trying to be condescending, it was a genuine question because lots of people confuse those. I've sewn plenty of elastic waist pants, and I haven't encountered that issue. I'm wearing a pair right now🤷♀️
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u/Dry-Conversation2646 55m ago
Thank you for explaining! I'm sorry I misinterpreted your reply.
Unfortunatly, I have the problem that if my back part of a waistband is elastic, it still droops while the front gets stuck on my belly. This particular pants' waistband should also sit at waist as design, so when the waistband falls down on the hips it really throws of the whole fit of the pants.
I was alittle stressed while doing this part aswell since it was 22.30 before a work day and my last pair of finished pants had broken irrepairably during the day, hence this BEC lol
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u/musicalnerd-1 1d ago
Body type does actually impact this. I think it’s less a plus size thing and more a waist to hip ratio thing. For me cutting elastic to my waist measurement works because my hip is significantly larger so the elastic doesn’t stretch out so much it goes past my hips (depends a bit on how stretchy the elastic is ofcourse). If your waist isn’t significantly smaller than your hip, yeah obviously cutting it to your waist measurement doesn’t work. Pattern makers really should know something about other people’s bodies and take that into consideration when making their patterns