Not much has changed for us this time around. Some things got cheaper, warlock skyrunners got more expensive. I don't think it's enough to make much of a difference, but we'll see how it plays out with the changes to all the other factions.
You know the drill. This is the megathread for discussing todays update. Any posts that can instead be comments on here will be removed and directed here. I'll leave it on feed for a few hours as more visible then pin it. Thanks OP for providing all the links etc
Great changes! Avatar at 250 is a very interesting choice now. I'm thinking 10 dragons (1 activation nuke) Vs an avatar (not as much damage but will probably get a turn or three in)
I went 3/2/0. Lost to the deathguard player that took 1st and necron player who took 2nd. Both those games were close too (within 10 points or so) just bad rolls and a few minor mistakes cost me them (both opponents were really good so any mistake was capitalized on).
Autarch wayleaper, melta and starglaive, timeless strategist (attached to 5 spiders)
2x spirit seer
storm guardians
2x wraithguard with d-scythe
2x5 warp spider leader with double flamers
rangers
2x wraithknight with ghostglaive, 2xstar cannon and scattershield
it was a very un-aeldari list and suprised quite a few people. And wraith knights and avatar are so dang fast so people aren't used to things that killy/tough slamming into them t1 or 2 so easily
Yah, sadly not conclave. Warhost (with take and hold and effecting the knights) was just better overall for my list. Though now that it is no longer take and hold warhost is not looking as good lol
I remember there being some discussion about wraithknights not getting access to battle focus. I assume that's not the case if you're using the extra movement in warhost to yeet them up the board
Im taking guardian battlehost+ obligatory seers/locks, with the avatar as a distraction carnifex (mainly because im bored of him gathering dust) and using skyreavers for secondaries (because I do not own anything thay can reasonably "counts as" skyrunners). With the points drops im thinking I might be able to upgrade my skyreavers to Hawks so I can dish out some mortals here or there as well.
Or maybe squeeze a solo warlock in whose job will be to run and hide somewhere important 🤔
Caveating all this by saying I am not going to a tournemant, its a casual weekend thing.
It’s also that you can make them an additional -1 with a strat and another -1 with a war walker too.
I run 3 blobs of 6 and have another blob of scatter lasers for all the obnoxious -1D targets.
It’s a solid list if you play well - you desperately have to trade up though or you will lose. It’s not an easy path bit it really catches people off guard.
Big changes for the Avatar & Wraithknights which I love. Also hoping that this is enough to bring the occasional Autarch.
This rolls back some of the "safety increases" from the first update which I like. Shows a willingness to admit mistakes.
My only gripe is the increase on Windriders, was hardly an oppressive build and with our WR, idk why you would start targeting the few performers but it's not the end of the world.
Yeah, hard to complain when there’s so much green. Step in the right direction for sure but it doesn’t feel to me like it will move the needle too much. I wasn’t getting the sense that we had particularly bad matchups into the top dogs, so them coming down in power doesn’t necessarily change a whole lot either in my eyes.
A lot of our lesser used units, especially non-epic characters, are becoming quite cheap, but that’s more reflective on their sub-par rules right now. I have to laugh at the continual slow slide of Shining Spear points lol.
I mean Purge has been nerfed, Disruption buffed, Seer Council buffed the top dogs ate nerfs and many of the more oppressive combos are now impossible. And most eldar lists should be able to get another unit out of it with some obvious winners amongst the datasheets opening up potentially new avenues.
It's also actually good now. The serpent is just so big, and can move a lot more freely around the table now. Move blocking with it is a very serious option. I don't think the points nerf to multiples was needed, since nobody would run that many seriously, but it also doesn't really impact most people.
I already thought running more than one after the nerf is absolutely wild since they cost way too much for what they do they are even too big for doing proper staging.
It's just a general thing they did on most Dedicated Transport for this dataslate : Cost of the 4th+ stays the same, cost of the first 3 down 10 points.
You can, and they enjoy it, but thanks to their inate rerolls, they don't need them to be good. Almost every other unit in our book, you need a transport, character or other layered buffs to make a max size unit good, so windriders really stand apart there.
To arrive on the battlefield, each strategic reserves unit must make an ingress move (see below). Unless otherwise stated, they can only do so from the second battle round onwards.
Unshrouded Truth states you must arrive this phase. That's "otherwise stated" and overrides the T1 restriction.
The other "WIN", or non Nerf, is that unlike many other factions, the pick up and put into strategic reserves is not restricted by being in Engagement range. Many other pick-up abilities are having that restriction put in in this dataslate.
Yes, the "Unshrouded Truth" Stratagem allows you to pick up a unit and place it into Strategic reserves. Unlike other such abilites, it does not have any restrictions as to where that Unit is.
Why not? It doesn't say you can't use it turn 1, and it states you must make an ingress move this phase, which I assume would over-rule the normal T1 restriction
Wait, Warhost is changing to Recon? Does this make it viable now? I remember it was the sort of “all rounder” detachment before I stepped away and it was decent then.
It should be a huge help for it. Purge didn't make sense for it, now I can see some interesting avenues. And while we're not as good at recon as the Drukhari, it's a lot better than Purge.
I'd say still at 3DP there's better detachment combos out there, but it being Recon certainly makes it more viable now. Think also Eldritch Raiders switching to Purge is a good change since that is the aggressive detachment, but it still probably has more play as Recon.
Well it's a 30pt Nerf to Seer Council via the Warlock Skyrunners, but several other units almost balance it out.
I see the updated the Stratagem at least:
SEER COUNCIL DETACHMENT Unshrouded Truth Stratagem,Target and Effect Sections Change to: 'TARGET: One ASURYANI INFANTRY unit from your army (excluding WRAITH CONSTRUCT units) that has not been selected to move this phase, was not set up on the battlefield this phase, and is within 9" of one or more friendly ASURYANI PSYKER models.
EFFECT:
▪ Place your unit in strategic reserves.
▪ Your unit has Deep Strike.
▪ Your unit must make an ingress move this phase.'
with warlock skyrunners being 55 and farseers skyrunner being 60, maybe its worth to run some solo farseer skyrunner for their -1 to wounds and better weapons.
Exactly, and the Tabletop Tactics review also didn't discuss it other than the boost to Fire Dragons due to being able to set-up at 8" rather than 9". Pretty sure they would have been all over that in their review of the Aeldari changes.
Got a 85 points reduction in my Serpent's Brood + Armored Warhost army, just what i needed to iron out the weaknesses of my list. Only nerf for me is on the Skyweavers, which is completely compensated by the points drop. Great day and back to the drawing board
Agree not that much changes. Like a Seer council list is about the same in points and that was probably the best option to run before. The points drops arent really big enough to make anything else really competitive, but it's better for list diversity and I can see more detachments and builds opening up.
The nerfs to top armies means we probably have game into more, but I don't see eldar becoming a 50% WR army or getting lots of wins, just less of a struggle.
The really impactful changes to me are Avatar and warlock skyrunners. I think the Avatar might become a staple and I won't start every list with 3x warlocks as recon. I might actually move away from that now even in seer council. The rest is nice, but very minor overall.
Im not mad about the updates, but this is not something that's a big buff or takes us out of the bottom half of armies. We'll just have to wait a bit longer for that.
Yeah that was my issue as well, have had to re-jiggle my list quite comprehensively actually.
Oh well, I needed some War Walkers at some poiint anyway (dropped my Wraithlords and switched to Armoured Warhost as secondary Detachment).
This is actually the biggest news for me. I was a Warhost player for all of my games in 10th, I really love the strats and enhancements. It being recon could be big for me.
Certainly a good start. Gw seems to recognize what we need - remember we have two more of these hitting by october so a soft hand should be expectedZ would LOVE yo see other aspects down by -5 points or so and (have that transferred to the phoenix lords in some cases) to make vanilla aspects a bit more tempting, but overall... this is good!
Particularly happy as a pirate player. Jump packs are more reasonable, voidscarred are beginning to look like a useful upgrade to voidreavers, especially in Wathost or Eldritch Raiders
I'm still running aspect host. It's not always easy, but it works for me. I've included the avatar in all of my games so far, and now he's cheaper too! What a time to be alive.
basically you are pushed towards using 2 jetlock and a jetseer in it cus thats the same point as before, what you lost on windriders gained back on jetseer and second jetlock not making more expenses just firepower from another beefed destructor... or just you know run them 3 which is indeed not the most economical with windrider host
My autarch points look the same on the app, although I like the Wayleaper reduction, make for a lovely solo asset for missions and key damage. Interesting that the 6 brick of windriders has gone up, I've been enjoying that but it won't impact my lists too much.
seems like my 3 venoms+1 raider idea for Devouted of Ynnead+armored warhost Reconaissance for Ynnari got better. Also hyped now that the seer council strat works as intended, being able to get fire dragons with fuegan into melta range and Asurmen+dire avenger into sustained hit range
Ah I didnt get that. I still think Asurmen deserve a point decrease with all the limitations to his move, but I wanted to include him in the example because maybe he can end up somewhat protected. The fuegan block teleport is where its at tho.
they wouldn't change datasheet in a regular dataslate but my god they could at least decrease the point of some of them (like incubi) that are garbage anyway compared to the drukhari version ..
You run war walkers for their ability, not their guns, and that doesn't get any better in a squad of 2.
The only case where this is relevant is if you were memeing around with GBH + AW, and bringing 6 of them already. Unfortunately, you can no longer use Cost of Victory on a farseer+warlock+conclave+guardian blob if all the guardians are dead, so that is a massive nerf to GBH, and 30 points back from that, plus other miscellaneous drops probably isn't enough to compensate for that.
Thanks…
I was contemplating switching towards taking 2 in a Seer Council List, just wasn’t sure if it was worth putting them together for the 10pt gain, or keeping them split.
What is the change that indicates cost of victory doesn’t work on a unit with no guardians left? The unit is the same and the characters are still the same unit
Apologies, I have had a closer look and I appear to be wrong. Tacoma Open had a FAQ that stated that destroyed models did not give the unit their keywords, and I am pretty sure it something similar was stated somewhat ambiguouly in the core rules earlier in the edition, but it appears not to be present anymore.
Cost of Victory targets a guardians unit, and what this meant was that as soon as the last guardian model died, the unit lost the guardian keyword, so you couldn't target it anymore.
It is one of the very few of the Tacoma FAQs that didn't make it into the proper official faqs.
in Imp Guard double sentinels worth the running than again they are way cheaper and more optimal for orders
For us i can imagine double war walkers for Guardian Host as fire platforms... 4 BL for 160 is generally better than a prism imo especially since hitting on2, and if lucky on 5++ and/or good position the mobility token can help a lot on safeguarding them out of los
So is there anything in Eldritch Raiders? Don't like purge but its 2dp so you can adjust that with one of the 1DPs.
BUT, skyreavers, back down, voidscarred down, avatar down, spears down, scorpions went down the time before, even wraithknights down. Even shrodrunners back down a bit as well.
All advancing and charging (and in most cases shooting) across the board.
It's not a bad detachment, but you have to build for it. AoK, Shining Spears, 2+ Wraithlords and Yriel with 10 man Voidscarred and Lance enhancement are mandatory in my opinion as you need to build for the advance and charge. Wraithblades with a Spirit Seer also can be good, Wraithknight I still think is too high points for what you get. If it drops another 30 or so points I think it becomes viable in ER. Scorpions are good but I think they still lack Karandras to give them a bit more punch.
It being Purge is also decent for how you want to play it, I still think you're probably better of playing Recon though unless you get a very favourable matchup like IG or something not very tough.
Yeh that was my thinking, avatar, banshees + jz, lykhis + spiders, some spears, wraithlords, skyreavers and the yriel brick with the voidscarred and scoring stuff for recon probably.
Exactly how I play it. My list has gotten about 60 points cheaper with the updates today so I’ll probably shake it around a bit to get another squad of Voidreavers in or Rangers.
Exported with App Version: v2.3.1 (1), Data Version: v913
A few tips:
* Use Yriels redeploy to take more advantage of infiltrators. You can redeploy infiltrated scorpions to let you scout
* Yriel goes in the transport to scout. Otherwise it’s just a nuisance
* Wraithlord goes near the Voidscarred as they have a psyker
* Baharoth just picks up screens for the first ~3 turns, you gotta keep the squad healthy as long as possible so play it safe
* Avatar should be mid board so it can go where it’s needed. Don’t forget the +1 to advanced and charges
* Eldrad also mid board at the back, use go to ground to get the +1 to wound buff without exposing yourself
Warhost becoming Recon is kinda cool. Warhost is still honestly pretty trash as a detachment on its face, but I could maybe see trying to make it work in a casual game. Recon is a much more fun playstyle than Purge for us, imo, so even if it’s not GOOD, I could at least see Warhost being more fun to play now. I’ll take it.
Also point changes feel good. I have a ton of Harlequins, so those got a lot cheaper. Points drops on Spiders and Hawks feel very good. The Avatar looks SO good now, this is doing a good job of making me want to buy one. Damn you, GW…
copy and pasta from tabletop battles explanation - should be searchable in the app tho
Monsters and Vehicles are also now affected by the FRAME keyword, which is the rules signifier for “measure to hull”. If such a model has no base, when pivoting it you rotate it around its central axis. There are a couple of weird edge cases here with some units that have bases and also FRAME which we expect to get cleared up in FAQ and Commentary.
It means you measure to the hull of the model rather than the base. It was a bit shocking to me our tanks especially didn't have it since we've got such tiny bases on them, but that's now been corrected.
Well this has saved me 60 points in my Eldritch Raiders list so either another squad of Rangers or I'll see if I can get the 5 points back to have some Voidreavers. Might chuck the Wraithblades back in maybe and see how they go.
Unshrouded truth finally got clarified and unfucked. 9" requirement to trigger, and now they word as that unit just gets put into strat reserves with deep strike and must ingress this movement phase.
I was happy most of my list got cheaper and then I saw my detachments disposition got changed and I was upset, and then I realized I run fateful performance with eldritch raiders so no change
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe they removed the ACROBATIC keyword from Serpent's Brood. If so it's now possible to double-dip on Harlequins detatchments for a monoquins army, though whether either of the 1pt detatchments is better for us than Armored Warhost to double buff our transports is a different question.
Edit: there seems to be a discrepancy between the MFM and faction pack.
Do I understand correctly that the change to Unshrouded Truth means we can't use it to throw a unit into the enemy's starting area right on the first turn?
Unshrouded Truth allows you to select any Asuryani Infantry (non wraith) Unit within 9" of a Psyker, regardless of whether they are in Engagement range or not, and move that unit to anywhere on the board.
The rule update fixes the 9" distance quirk we had so that now it just says you go into reserve, gain deep strike and MUST come back this turn. Deep Strike rule says 8" away from any enemy unit. That's the real fix here and allows things like Fire Dragons to teleport directly into Melta range.
So even Turn 1 you can teleport into your opponent's deployment zone (standard Deep Strike rule), IF there is enough space to do so, which is usually not the case as most armies should be able to screen that out. But still...
Nice to see Glaiveknight come down but he really should only be 350 given how low impact he is.
EDIT - Still holding out hope that they either remove the [Acrobatic] keyword from Quin detachments or if your faction is Harlequins ignore this keyword but guessing that might come in the codex.
This feels like a big slate for Eldritch raiders. Not sure how the change to the detachment itself will feel moving off disruption but the actual points for so many units you like to run in ER are down.
I haven't played much last editions, but it's so weird to see that it's only a 5p difference between a warlock & farseer skyrunner, and somehow the foot seer is more expensive than the bike..?
So does it mean I can now play and learn eldar without auto losing or are we not there yet? I'm refraining from playing them despite collecting them as I know they've been absolutely garbage for 12 months or something?
It's rough out there, but I've won all my games with my aspect host so far (while losing basically my entire army in the process, but that's just how 40k works these days). I don't feel this is enough to meaningfully move the needle, and for the more competitive lists (seer council), the points work out be around net even anyway.
If you like the faction, just go for it and start learning how to play. We've been in a rough spot for a while now, but we'll be back on top soon sooner or later. And realistically: outside of the top tables of tournaments, player level matters much more than the differences in army strength. Just play the mission, and make sure to deny your opponent from scoring when you can, and you'll be just fine.
Yeah, then I guess you'd be Sol considering the quantity of corsair available to us. Isn't that great.
I would argue though that pirates will never shy away from an opportunity and if that means supporting another unit type to benefit themselves financially or militarily wouldn't be out of the question
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u/sciencep1e Ulthwé Jul 22 '26
You know the drill. This is the megathread for discussing todays update. Any posts that can instead be comments on here will be removed and directed here. I'll leave it on feed for a few hours as more visible then pin it. Thanks OP for providing all the links etc