The secret is that the actual humans matter at this point. Nike probably wants to release the shoe when they have a Nike athlete ready to demonstrate. That should be Jacob Kiplimo at Chicago.
I think Nike has a big issue now. the zoom pod is not a dominant tech anymore (there is simply no good evidence foam can't match or beat the pods). but the pods are for sure heavier than the modern foam. Evo gen 1 was released a few months before alphafly 3 and there had been two iterations of Evo (which kept getting lighter). At this level, being that much lighter itself is a display of tech dominance. Nike can't shed the pods which means it would be very difficult for them to create a truly light weight top end racer. It would be hard to imagine any pod can bridge a 50 - 100g weight gap.
if you look at the peg plus 2 (pods in forefoot) and how heavy that shoe is (by the standard of a 2026 upscale tempo trainer, it already failed miserably). you know nike will still have a hard time in the next 1-2 product cycles
This has been Nikes flagship distance shoe for like 10 years now. Yes adidas has produced the Evo which is their flagship but this is Nikes current answer until they release something that’s better.
I guess the point is that the Alphafly is designed and priced to actually be sold, and to a lot of runners. The EVO 3 isn’t really mass market, that is the Adios pro 4 (5 when it comes out)
That thing is holding them back while ASICS/Adidas are making the best shoes in the industry. It’s why hardly any of On’s latest racers have “cloud tech” holes. They knew they had to go. Nike designers need to make the same realisation.
There is an alternative universe where Asics sells a GEL MetaSpeed Ray. I guess marketing has a lot more control over what gets made at Nike than other companies.
There is a certain section of society (mainly the young and the simple) that can be convinced putting plastic pockets of air into shoes is a useful thing. It is a sales gimmick and it is an effective one.
Saying this shows you clearly have not run in the Alphafly 1s, victory 2s, or the Vomero premiums in which they utilise this tech well and you are just being stubborn
AF1 were great, but shoes like fastr3 are so much further ahead now. It was the split midsole and aggressive rocker than made the AF1 great, pods were secondary in my opinion.
Took the words out of my mouth, thanks. Yeah it works great in those shoes though I do agree with the sentiment that Nike has an overreliance on the AZ tech in general and that it's not a great all purpose "slap it on" fix to make shoes better
ON has all but moved on in their pinnacle product because they realized that gimmicks don't work at the elite level. I say this as a big fan of the ON training lineup
They are getting smaller, but it is so bad. Why make a shoe squeaky on purpose? I have to grease my shoe -- I don't want to, but if I don't the holes squeak. Nice feeling shoe, but never again.
No, not necessarily. They pods work well. It is part of the Nike style! Also, practically there is not much to choose amongst the top tier supershoes these days in terms of performance (Puma Fast R is a notch above but not by much)-- alphafly, adios pro, Metaspeed,... it depends more on the runner! Wear what suits you-- they dont all suit everybody the same.
That is it! Those air pods are heavy and provide less benefit than not having them. FWIW I prefer the vapourfly which is a similar shoe, without the airpods
I honestly think the delay is Nike trying, desperately, to reduce the weight while keeping the pods.
AF3 was an amazing shoe and IMO an absolutely amazing marathon shoe for all abilities as it is so forgiving both in the upper and the pods/foam. I think they're panicking because lighter shoes have come out and they think they need to compete.
For us hobby joggers I just don't think weight is that much of an issue. We have a ton of other things to work on to get faster before worrying about a few grams on a shoe.
I think the weight around the food is the biggest and most valuable difference you can actually feel immediately on a run when wearing different shoes. That air pocket is insignificant for hobby joggers
Nikes crazy down turn on the market is really showing and I believe they would have released AF4 long ago if it wasn’t for the new records set by adidas. Nike need to set records or AF4 will not be any serious competitor. At least that’s how I believe the running consumers/communities will see it
Consumers aren’t going to pay $500 for a super shoe that lasts one race. The Adios Pro Evo 3 is exceptional and isn’t going to be seen from race runners who don’t have a chance to podium at a major marathon event. The Alphafly is cheap enough for the average runner to afford, and same with the Adios Pro 4.
Breaking records in a serious competitor shoe is very different than breaking records in a consumer shoe. Even if Nike came out with a record-breaking $500 shoe, most runners aren’t going to see the benefit in buying it.
I think the brand value of the Evo 3 breaking the WR and 2 hours helps adidas sell more consumer shoes. The average runner might not be in the market for a $500 shoe, they might be more inclined to think adidas is the best running shoe brand, especially in a head to head with Nike.
You do have a point, especially when their trainers and Adios Pro 4 back up the brand very well. I’m wondering if the rest of the competition (especially Nike) will react to the Evo 3, and put out a similarly priced, on-the-verge engineered shoe out to compete with the Evo 3 because of the marketing angle that shoe brings.
You think these guys are ripping 120+ miles a week with threshold work everyday and aren’t pissing hot if you catch them at the wrong time? Or is it just normal that actual juiced WRs, like the HM, are broken with the guys looking barely winded at the finish line?
I’m not saying these aren’t incredible athletes, but you have to be naive to think any of the top are clean.
I want this shoe more than anyone and have been waiting a long time for it… but yeah, they seem to have bigger fish to fry. Wall St is eviscerating Nike and its CEO right now.
This is a mismanagement of the company, creating hype, holding out. Why other competitors have shifted to faster release capturing the market instead. While consumers wait, we buy other brands, and brand loyalty shifts. Just look at Nike's stock price, taking like their thinking and products. Too focused on colorways, styles, and less on RND. Even Chinese brands are killing nike using high tech foams
Nike have painted themselves into a corner with the dependence on what once was In the quest to create a lightweight running shoe Airzoom can no longer come in that journey. They should license Superboom from Li Ning and market it as “the all new Airzoom” 😂 but seriously.
I can’t even imagine they have the chops to move on from PEBA based ZoomX. Design by committee is an anchor around their heels.
Every company already got the same foam and plates. I think Nike’s betting on their aero-fit style uppers for extra performance gain. These look super light.
What has ASICS actually won over the last 10 years? Can someone compare it with Nike? Everyone in this sub seems to be jumping on the ASICS bandwagon, as well as the “Nike hate” bandwagon because of the hype or the “feel,” but I don’t really see ASICS winning anything?
I don’t wear Nike or ASICS myself, so I don’t have a personal preference here. It’s just getting a bit tiring, and honestly, it’s also a little sad to see how much social media can influence people’s opinions.
Yes, because consumers are paying for all that marketing and frontrunner shoe hype, too. All I see on social media are influencers hyping ASICS and nothing else. They used to be a serious running shoe manufacturer, but now they choose marketing instead. At least that’s my opinion. I wear Puma %90 of the time cause I found them half price all the time.
I knew that and asked because the guy I responded to telling that Nike stopped being a serious race shoe manufacturer. So in the last 10 years ASICS winning one major means it’s more serious manufacturer than Nike I suppose lol
Yeah, it’s 4, and Nike won 35. My point still stands, though. Does winning four marathons make ASICS a better shoe manufacturer? Last year’s Sydney Marathon was won by a guy wearing ASICS, and this year it was won in an Alphafly prototype. I mean, if you’re calling a brand a serious manufacturer based on marathon wins, then Nike should be at the top.
Nike used to be at the top. Now it’s adidas. With 45 podiums for adidas in the last 2.5 years vs. 25 for Nike and 17 for asics. And 4 wins for Nike vs 3 wins for asics. It’s obvious Nike fell off hard and Nike/asics is closer than you think. And I’m sure Nike pays more too.
As I mentioned earlier, I don’t wear Nike or ASICS, -I’m wearing Puma shoes mainly because of their outlet prices-, and you can also check my posts. I’m simply talking about how people’s opinions can change based on social media trends, and how “kicking down” Nike seems to be popular nowadays.
In my opinion, for regular runners, these results shouldn’t matter that much, as performance also depends on the individual athlete. The athlete who finished third in the Sydney Marathon today was wearing Xtep, so does that mean Xtep is suddenly better than ASICS which was not in top 3?
I’m not even sure where the Alphafly 4 is at this point. Alphafly 3 was released in January 2024, almost three years ago and since then, ASICS and Adidas have released multiple racing shoes and have clearly caught up with Nike, with Adidas arguably even taking the lead.
My original response was to the comment above mine saying that “Nike stopped being a serious race shoe manufacturer.” I can understand someone saying, “They haven’t released a proper new racing shoe and they’re falling behind,” etc because that’s something we can actually discuss. But saying they’ve stopped being a serious race shoe manufacturer feels like a bit of an overreach, doesn’t it?
Anyway, we’ll see what the next Alphafly brings. Hopefully we won’t have to wait too long.
Yes, I was dismissing Asics based on the last 10 years results which I already mentioned “last 10 years” in my comment and if you look at the data you can see I was right but if we’re talking about last 2.5 years you’re right, they’re close, yet Nike still ahead of Asics.
Asics nowhere near to those brands because they are too busy paying content creators than making half decent shoes. I would even say Mizuno is more likely to dethrone those two giants considering how much progress they made with their top tier racers.
Every Nike running shoe thread in this sub is about how Nike has fallen, Adidas/ASICS/Puma are the kings now, how zoom pods suck, how heavy Nike shoes are, how Nike hasn’t made a good running shoe in so long, etc.
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u/RustyDoor 2d ago edited 2d ago
Just release them. It's been 2 years, 7 months, and 26 days since the 3s.