r/StartingStrength • u/Ballaw • 3d ago
Intermediate Programming Question Deadlift programming - when to switch to rack pulls and haltings
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38 Male 230 lbs
I was stuck at 355 deadlift for almost 3 weeks before I could get a full 1x5. Just got 1x3s before. This is my first 360 attempt and I couldn't get the 5th rep. I deadlift once a week on my squat light day. Seems like failing a little too much. What is the indicator that I should switch to rack pulls and halting deadlifts, and if so what weight do you start them at relative to deadlift PR? My eating and sleep is good. I'm still gaining 1/4 to 1/2 pound a week. Thanks for any help
FYI if it is relevant:
Squat 285 3x5
Deadlift 355 1x5
Bench 195 1x5 2x5 90% drop sets
Press 145 7 singles
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u/John_Coctoastan 2d ago
Someone's been eating Scooby Snacks
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u/Ballaw 2d ago
Eating Scooby snacks, smashing pots, and robbing the rich to save the poor, according to all you guys
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u/John_Coctoastan 2d ago
Heyyyy, you don't know a man who wears a hook by chance, do you? If not, ask your friend Tinkerbell if she does.
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u/misawa_EE 3d ago
Two potential paths you can take, I’ve done both and had success.
First option is to rotate rep ranges over 3 weeks, doing 1x5, 1x3, and 1x1. When I did this, I added 10-15 lbs between weeks - for example, 355x5, 370x3, 385x1. Next time adding 5 to each of those if I successfully moved the weight. I added in some back off work as well. This worked for me for a couple of months.
Second, and my now preferred option, is as soon as I get close to failure on 5s, I move to blocks and keep adding 5lbs at 5reps. I have a couple of block heights I can do before I’m at rack pull height. I have found this to help drive my set of 5 better than 5/3/1 method above.
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u/Ballaw 3d ago
Is this your own way or is it blessed by an SSC? I think they favor sets of five. I don't have access to blocks in my gym but isn't it just cheating the start position? With rack pulls you pair with haltings so the full range is expressed.
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u/misawa_EE 2d ago
No sir, I’m not that smart. 😄
The methods above are from Practical Programming (the gray book) and The Barbell Prescription (over 40s lifters), all companion books to SS blue book.
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u/Ballaw 2d ago
I have the grey book. Which part are you referring to. I saw some stuff about doing 5s then moving to 3s then 1s but it was moving as necessary not week to week like you showed
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u/misawa_EE 1d ago
Had to go dig out my books, but the 5/3/1 method I got from TBP, so it may not be the most applicable for you.
A resident SS coach that frequents here made the recommendation for moving to rack pulls at sets of 5 to keep driving progress and that has worked nicely for me.
Once you get to this stage things can be different from lifter to lifter. The idea is to make the smallest possible change to keep driving progress.
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u/sbfx 3d ago
Have you experimented with mixed grip, chalk, or straps? It looks like your grip could be giving out a bit?
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u/Ballaw 3d ago
I am using hook grip and chalk. It feels pretty secure. Hurts a bit but during the rep don't feel any slippage.
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u/BrentKindaLifts Knows a Thing or Two 2d ago
Consider trying straps, and you’ll need them for rack pulls. Based on my experience, the pain gets to my head after doing multiple reps. I like using a hook grip for heavy singles, mainly because it shortens the range of motion by an inch. Hell, there are some freaks like Robert Santana who can pull 480x8 with a hook grip, which makes me look like a pussy.
Either try straps, pull heavy biweekly, or switch to rack/halting
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u/Technical-Voice-9114 2d ago
I am by no means an expert. But…
How long have you been lifting?
How much is each lift progressing each week? Each month?
Is deadlift more important for you than squat?
How much of each lift are you doing per week?
You seemed to favor your back when you finished, are you overloading your back?
Are you recovering enough before each session?
Could a short deload week help?
Eating enough?
I should also say I’m not a starting strength person, so I don’t know the specifics of starting strength progressions. These are generic questions that could lead you to your own answers.
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u/maester_morley 2d ago
Dude. Thats some weight!! Seriously impressive. How tall are you? You have super long legs like me
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u/geruhl_r 2d ago
You should switch now. Make sure the rack pulls start below your knee. Haltings, RDL, rack pulls, etc for volume. I like a heavy triple with back offs for heavy DL days in early intermediate programs. As you progress further, you'll need to split that intensity into halting and rack pulls. But for now, you should be able to tolerate the heavy triple.
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u/Ballaw 2d ago
So I should just keep adding five pounds a week with a single triple? Any reason not to do 2x3? The first three on the 360 felt good.
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u/geruhl_r 2d ago
Yes. You could do two triples if you wanted. But let me be clear, this is your week:
- heavy day: triple at 360, 3x5 at 315. (OR 2-3 sets of 2-3 heavy reps)
- medium day: 3 sets of 5-8 reps RDL
- light day: 3x8 rows or chins
You can do rack pulls and haltings instead for the light and medium days, but at lighter weights. Look at Andy Baker's HLM templates for percentages.
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u/Rothbardy 2d ago
Make sure your nutrition, sleep, and hormone levels are optimal. You can switch to rack pulls and haltings, you would want to avoid it if you can make progress using the complete lift. You could also try adding volume, work up a heavy single set of five (DL), then back off 5-10% and do a couple of sets.
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u/mymindismycastle 2d ago
How are you able to lift this mich with bare hands. I struggle with loosing grip at 90 kgs.
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u/kinggargantuan 2d ago
I think push your hips forward at lockout rather than leaning back with upper body. Also may need to keep your neck neutral. I’d suggest toes parallel rather than pointed out, but unsure if that matters
Also how deep are your squats?
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u/Ballaw 2d ago edited 2d ago
You point the toes out so you can keep your joints tight. I torque the feet, knees, and thighs out. My squats are deep. Probably too deep tbh
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u/kinggargantuan 2d ago edited 2d ago
No such things as too deep squats. Slight angle out on the toes is good for deadlifts but his seems excessive
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u/hebert_str Starting Strength Coach 1d ago
I’d just throw that weight in the rack now and get 5. Stiffen up your lockout some. Get that north of 405lbs and keep eating. Can throw a lighter halting on your other days or just keep your power clean/power snatch.
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u/tranquilsloth 3d ago
Ruh roh Raggy!