r/TheAmericans • u/FactorPrevious4707 • 3d ago
Martha
I'm watching the show for the first time and I'm on episode 12 of season 1 and Martha's character is just way too naive.
Like Clark has never even showed her where he lives, what he likes to do in his free time and everything she knows about this man is what he tells her when they hook up at her place.
She blindly does what he tells her to do without questioning it or by not listening to the inkling of doubt that sometimes she has but she decides to ignore. I'm sorry but her character is a joke 😅
Edit: this post was meant to be a fun discussion but I guess you guys have parasocial relationships with the characters on the show so I'm out 😭😭
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u/Responsible_Emu8267 2d ago
I think she's lonely, and she loves him and wants it to be real, and she's projecting what she wants the relationship to be onto him. She's filling in the blanks with her own narrative. This is common in abusive relationships, which one could argue this is an emotionally abusive situation. If you love the person and feel like things are perfect some of the time, you can explain away the other parts with your own narrative to make it make sense to stay.
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u/ComeAwayNightbird 2d ago
No question, this is an abusive relationship. Clark gives Martha just enough to string her along, and withholds affection strategically to manipulate her.
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u/Adept-Depth-1825 2d ago
It’s based on true stories so it might seem unbelievable but this was a known KGB approach. And he does seem like a great lover.
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u/FactorPrevious4707 2d ago
I know, although the show makes it more dramatic for obvious reasons. I'm just commenting on the naivety of the character.
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u/the_othergirl7 2d ago
think about it. there's no social media, no way to connect with others. it's hard to meet someone at a bar especially if you have to keep your work life secret. then this handsome guy shows up, knows about her job, and just woos her in all the right ways.
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u/FactorPrevious4707 2d ago
I'm not saying it's impossible for it to happen. I'm just saying she's objectively naive.
I'm naturally not a very trusting person so I would have made different choices compared to the character and that's just my opinion.19
u/Remote-Ad2120 2d ago
It's not realistic to judge people (fictional or otherwise) based solely on what you would/wouldn't do. People make choices based on their unique life experience.
Are you as desperate for love, as Martha was? Have your relationship experience been limited, as Martha's was? Seen as the "plain Jane", attracting abusive (physical and/or emotional), or stalkerish men, just has her exes were? You say you are naturally not very trusting. But Martha was trusting for anyone who would pay her any kind of romantic interest. Clark did that, and was the opposite of all her previous failed relationships.
I see too many people who judge others on what they would/wouldn't do. Look at any "Paige is annoying" post and there will be at least one "I would never talk to my parents the way she does" comment.
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u/FactorPrevious4707 2d ago
It's not just about what I wouldn't do, I think every individual should be more careful in these situations. Considering the world we live in, nobody should be as trusting and as naive as Martha, even though she is a fictional character. Because I'm pretty sure her fate is sealed.
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u/Puzzleheaded_Sky6656 2d ago
But she doesn’t live in the world we live in.
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u/FactorPrevious4707 2d ago
That's besides the point, characters are based on people and human interactions. And as some other commenters pointed out, their relationship was based on real-events.
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u/Tejanisima 2d ago
But that's what makes it so bizarre that you keep talking about her being too naive to be plausible, given that we know IRL there were people who fell for this shit and it's unlikely that they had a whole lot more to go on than Martha does at this point. That's not so much rage, as it is exasperation at you undermining your own point.
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u/FactorPrevious4707 1d ago
Exasperation 😂, do you even know what that big word means?
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u/AlienLiszt 2d ago
Well, he would not have chosen you as his victim. I have known some incredibly naive women and this is plausible. Think about women who are routinely abused by their husbands/partners and still stay with them.
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u/8thGlass 2d ago
yeah buddy idk what to tell you, Martha is one of the best characters on the show so if you think she’s a joke better cut your losses now.
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u/FactorPrevious4707 2d ago
I thought the purpose of these communities was to express opinions and exchange perspectives. Why are y'all so easily ragebatable? Lmao
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u/8thGlass 2d ago
your conclusion being that I am rage baited says more about you than me dude lmao
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u/FactorPrevious4707 2d ago
Ok 😂
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u/WendolaSadie 2d ago
I think the reactions (including mine) about Martha, in particular, illustrate the quality writing and acting of the Martha storyline. And of the series in general. Most viewers feel protective of her. Poor Martha. Enjoy.
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u/Maggiethecataclysm 2d ago
Martha is not a joke
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u/WendolaSadie 2d ago edited 2d ago
Martha embodies the opposite values that P&E embody. Or, rather, what the Soviet training they received embodies. She is overflowing with love, loyalty, naivety, trust…to a fault. She is the (skewed) moral center of the series. She is heartbreaking.
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u/Cherita33 2d ago
Nah this is one of the best storylines on the show.
And this happened in real life to FBI secretaries.
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u/hamletgoessafari 2d ago
The pressure on a single woman of Martha's age in the 1980s to get married was immense. She would have had friends with husbands and children and wondered WTF was wrong with her. Clark showed her consistent interest and affection without being a douchebag like Amador. She jumped at the chance to get married to a man who was nice to her.
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u/the_othergirl7 3d ago
the world is a lonely place and her only other option was Amador. Keep watching!
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u/Still-Balance6210 2d ago
If you’ve never watched the show I’d stay off this sub until you’re done. Spoilers will happen.
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u/Charming_Function_58 2d ago
Sadly naive people like this do exist, and they are specifically chosen as victims by their perpetrators. Not just by the KGB. It’s universal.
Martha’s storyline gets a LOT more interesting as time goes on
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u/2outhits 2d ago
Poor Martha
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u/WendolaSadie 2d ago
My husband was a first time viewer, and I kept mumbling “Poor Martha” after all her scenes, and he kept asking me “Do they kill her??” And I kept saying “Worse.”
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u/2outhits 2d ago
Lol, my late wife also had a tough time keeping secrets about Martha when I was a first time watcher and she had seen it already. She also kept muttering "poor Martha" when she was in an episode.
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u/Sledjoys 2d ago
I initially felt this way about Martha, too, when I watched the series, but as other comments have pointed out, this kind of phenomenon is sadly all too common in abusive relationships.
Phillip - the KGB - knew exactly what they were doing when they started working on Martha.
Also, I would stay away from the subreddit to avoid spoilers, which I did until I finished the series two days ago.
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u/sistermagpie 2d ago
She's not naive. Everybody who gets scammed looks naive and dumb to people outside of it.
Clark is playing on Martha's weaknesses. She doesn't have to ask him to show her his place because she tells herself he's preemptively answered more important questions by being nerdy and by the books. He sees her the way she wants to see herself--as an adventerous person in a thrilling, forbidden romance.
He doesn't have to have answers for her suspicions, because he's giving her something more important--reasons to not think about those suspicions.
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u/PermanentlyDubious 2d ago
It's a little bit difficult to talk/debate with someone only 12 episodes on. Most of the posters on this board have seen the entirety of this show, and so I think that's why people are debating you or taking umbrage. There's an imbalance of information.
By the way, I strongly don't advise participating in these boards until you have watched the whole series. People inadvertently give away spoilers all the time even without meaning to, and you are going to mess up your experience.
Broadly, yes, I think you are right that Martha is naive. But it also seems to me that Martha is very lonely and without a lot of options for quality men, and very much wants a husband and child.
While the actress who plays her in real life is markedly more attractive than the character, and in real life looks like a cross between Danica McKellar and Kristin Davis, the character Martha as portrayed on the show is fairly severe and on the homely side. She reminds me of an Austrian headmaster at a school who does out physical punishment.
Early 80s seems like a sexy time? with Olivia Newton John singing about getting physical, disco era and spandex had just ended, Jane Fonda fitness craze. Martha looks like a school marm. Even the name is boring.
She's also not portrayed as a woman who is incredibly sweet, funny, highly personable, or possessing of great empathy or insight.
I think she comes across as a severe, kind of self righteous "good girl" who has played by a certain set of mental rules and thus feels entitled by being that to success in life and is frustrated. As a result, Martha can come across as strangely demanding and out of touch, and in some ways not that sympathetic.
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u/DarthDregan 2d ago
Keep watching. She isn't naive, she knows something is off, she chooses to believe what he says because she wants the relationship.
But yeah. Keep watching.
And bare in mind that KGB spy is not the first thing on the list of "he doesn't show me where he lives." And there is a long ass list of things before that.
We all ignore inconvenient things when they're tied to something we want a little too much. Which isn't naivety. It's just straight up human nature.
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u/Mundane-Chance4030 2d ago
Regarding being a good lover- he was trained to use his mind by KGB. When in training first had to make love to lovely young woman,then
an old unattractive woman, and then an old unattractive man. Mind over matter!
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u/ancientastronaut2 2d ago
He has great excuses for all that. Like she can't go to his apartment due to his (fake) job with the fbi, because it was against the rules since she was someone he was interviewing for work.
But also she was lonely and liked his schlong.
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u/1flawedplan 2d ago
I think she’s supposed to soften your heart. There are so very many like poor Martha in this world. To argue with that could be seen as naive.
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u/stand_up_eight_ 1d ago edited 12h ago
How very dare you! 😲
Conventionally unattractive women really had few options and were easily flattered back then. They still can be, but this is a time when being single past a certain age put you into spinster territory and further decreased your chances of marrying. To be brutal, she wasn’t just naive… she was desperate. 💔
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u/Sudden-Grab2800 1d ago
What does that mean? Why did you say that name? WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME?? MARTHA!! WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME??
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u/uniqueusername316 1d ago
Piggybacking on this to comment on what an incredible job Allauon Wright did with her character and performance.
She portrays such a dynamic character and range of intense emotion that we get to see from different angles.
She carries us through such deep betrayal and victimization that these stories epitomize. Sure, P&E hurt and kill many, but they really tortured poor Martha on emotional and psychological ways.
The casting was very well done. It's amazing how Martha can be seen as attractive and appealing in some scenes and absolutely pathetic and almost repulsive in others.
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u/FactorPrevious4707 1d ago
I think we need to be real, she's conventionally unattractive and that is what her character is supposed to be. It is even addressed in the show when Clark let's her listen to what her colleagues think about her, he manipulated the audio to make sure she was hurt but Gaad admits he purposely chose an ugly secretary.
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u/1flawedplan 14h ago
You misunderstand that scene. It wasn’t made for the audience to nod along and heartily agree that Martha is ugly. It’s character development-depicting the everyday objectification of trusting women by ordinary, awful men who have no clue they’re indulging bigotry, double standards and general POS behavior. No one involved in the series truly believes Martha is ugly.
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u/Waste_Stable162 2d ago
There was someone named Martha she spied, she spied. Her husband said he loved her, he lied! He lied! That's why her career is dead, because she listened to a red. There was someone called Martha, she spied.
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u/Puzzled-Smoke-6349 3d ago
Love makes you do stupid things. It's historically proven.