r/politics • u/masterchief6913 • Jul 15 '26

No Paywall Fetterman warns he would leave Democratic Party if it turns its back on Israel

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/5970730-john-fetterman-democratic-party-israel/
19.7k Upvotes

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2.5k

u/Mfrack103 North Carolina Jul 15 '26

Threatening to stop pretending to be a Democrat isn’t really a big claim

100

u/SurvivorFanatic236 Jul 16 '26

The thing is, he at least votes with Democrats on judicial nominations.

If he switches parties, he’s suddenly going to change his mind about wanting conservative judges

39

u/tichris15 Jul 16 '26

Unless the balance of the senate changes, that doesn't really matter.

In a world where it was 51 democrats, losing him would become a big deal.

10

u/StrawberryItten Jul 16 '26

I mean isn't that world very plausible past the midterms?

1

u/blastatron Jul 18 '26

Sadly a 51 split in the Senate is a fairly realistic possibility so appeasing Fetterman in that scenario would becomes incredibly important.

1

u/FlyingBishop Jul 16 '26

I mean, okay but unless the balance of the senate changes it doesn't matter anyway. And forcing Fetterman out of the party is going to push the balance the other way, full stop. FFS everyone is trying to purge the Democratic party of pro-Israel people, if this keeps up it's going to end up with leftists being purged from the country. We are on the razor's edge and people are talking like sticking it to Fetterman is going to do anything other than get people killed.

1

u/NumeralJoker Jul 16 '26

I think criticisms of this current Israeli admin are extremely valid, as are criticizing their pressure and influence on our politics, their war crimes in Palestine... all of it, but a lot of the "Israel is Apartheid and should be disbanded" talk is going way too far the other way. I bawk at anything less than a 2 state solution, personally.

All that said, their influence in our government is beyond ridiculous and needs to stop. A don't think one genocide being countered with another is ever going to solve anything, even if I would prefer we'd be less uninvolved there.

1

u/NumeralJoker Jul 16 '26

I think that's exactly the point.

That all said, there's a difference between him becoming an independent who caucuses with them still, and going full Republican. I honest to god think no one here knows for sure which he'd do, because it depends on how deeply in AIPAC's funding he is and whether or not those donors basically order him to switch to the GOP. And I don't think 'that' move is necessarily set in stone either.

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u/13lackMagic Jul 16 '26

He’s not threatening to become a Republican, he’s threatening to become an independent that caucuses with the democrats like Bernie Sanders or Angus King

5

u/foomits Jul 16 '26

Honestly probably better, he has 0 chance for reelection as it stands anyways. but maybe he can stop poisoning whatever tiny iota of good will the national dem party still has.

4

u/Hearthhull_Enjoyer Jul 16 '26

That really wouldn't be a step much further than how he votes on things already. He would just be dropping the pretenses and it would be that much easier for voters to replace him. It would be deeply revealing if he did go through it with it though. Crooked man.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

[deleted]

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u/ItsCalledRegret Jul 16 '26

Manchin is gone so who else would be the spoiler vote now? Dems love their rotating villains

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u/Belkroe Jul 15 '26

While I have real issues with Fetterman, he has voted in line with the Democratic Party over 90% of the time. While I would love for him to be replaced by a progressive Democrat, I still prefer him than a mainstream republican.

79

u/IdkAbtAllThat America Jul 16 '26

Which is why this is a fucking insane thing for him to say out loud.

"I'll stop doing what I think is best for my constituents if Israel doesn't get money"

Whether or not Israel is getting money shouldn't have anything at all to do with how he votes on other issues. We all know it does, but saying it out loud is crazy even for him.

Ostensibly he's a Democrat because he believes in Democrat ideals and policy. So if Israel doesn't get money, he's going to stop supporting those policies? So it was never about what he thought was right or wrong....

This country is so beyond fucked that a politician can say this and it will be forgotten about by tomorrow morning.

9

u/13lackMagic Jul 16 '26

You’re misunderstanding what he’s threatening to do. He’s not suddenly going to abandon the rest of the democratic policies he supports. He is threatening to go from a democratic senator, to an independent senator that caucuses with the democrats, the same as Bernie sanders or angus king - or sinema and manchin previously

4

u/ducksekoy123 Jul 16 '26

He may well abandon the rest of the Democratic policies he supports, he’s not shown to have any kind of commitment on anything shy of being an ogre and supporting Israel’s war machine.

3

u/13lackMagic Jul 16 '26

I mean he has voted with the democratic party 90% of the time on unity votes, so despite siding with the administration in a handful of well-documented cases its not like he's been inconsistent since in office.

3

u/Noocawe America Jul 16 '26

Thank you....

I really don't understand people who'd rather have a representative that gives them 0, rather than someone they can work with 80 or 90% of the time. It is so weird and crazy to me. In addition to being so at odds with how our government works, or just how society functions in general.

2

u/13lackMagic Jul 16 '26

People enjoy being angry more than they enjoy being effective.

I'm not even sure many of the people expressing this POV actually believe it, like if the angry democratic voters in this thread did a blind comparison between the voting records of fetterman and the other PA senator (McCormick) they would opt for Fetterman 10 times out of 10. Let alone what you mention about the other benefits of having an additional dem senator on the tally when we are pushing for a majority.

3

u/FlyingBishop Jul 16 '26

He has shown a lot of commitment, just not to the policies you would like. He was pretty clear about being pro-Israel when he ran. He has a point of view, it's not leftist, it's a bit right for a Democrat, but he's still a Democrat.

0

u/ducksekoy123 Jul 16 '26

No he votes for many democratic things that never end up passing.

But he actively undermines the party in public and media.

3

u/FlyingBishop Jul 16 '26

Democrats cannot pass anything because they do not control the legislature. They can only really stop things from being passed. The only things Democrats can pass are things where people like Fetterman and Susan Collins agree with Dems.

1

u/KWilt Pennsylvania Jul 16 '26

I mean, he's literally working with McCormick to have a joint PAC. As in, he and a Republican Senator are quite literally sharing a wallet when it comes to campaign contributions.

I'm glad he's at least saying the quiet part out loud so people can open their fucking eyes and see that he's literally trying to help someone he supposedly diametrically opposes keep their Senate seat by sharing cash with them.

97

u/Sennten Jul 16 '26

What does "voted line over 90% of the time" actually mean? I dont think 90% of votes are even party line votes. Especially when Republicans are in charge of what even comes up to vote right now

What matters is how many times he's   voted with the party when something meaningful is on the line and his vote might matter. So go ahead and share some good meaningful votes hes made, because he definitely doesnt agree on 90% of democratic policies

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u/bpm195 Jul 16 '26

I dont think 90% of votes are even party line votes.

93.5% of Senate votes and 70.4% of House votes are "party unity votes," based on 2025 data.

Party unity votes occur, under the CQ Roll Call definition, when a majority of one party, counting independents who caucus with the Democrats, votes against the majority of the other party. Votes that are broadly bipartisan do not count here, though they may count in the presidential support tabulations.

About Fetterman specifically.

In the Senate, Pennsylvania Democrat John Fetterman has effectively taken the mantle from former West Virginia Sen. Joe Manchin III as topping the list of Democrats most likely to vote against his own party, doing so almost 20 percent of the time.

But also about Pennsylvania:

Among Republicans, Rep. Brian Fitzpatrick of Pennsylvania led the way for breaking with his caucus (on 18.9 percent of unity votes), just as he did with the presidential support scores, where he went against Trump almost one-third of the time.

Source: https://rollcall.com/2026/03/05/vote-studies-2025-sets-new-mark-for-partisanship-on-capitol-hill/

Fascinating that the Blue Team Senator and the Red Team Congressman that succeed the most are both from Pa.

56

u/OutlyingPlasma Jul 16 '26

What does "voted line over 90% of the time"

It means all those unanimous resolutions honoring some bus driver in Nebraska, or changing the name of some airport.

31

u/JabroniusHunk Jul 16 '26

That was my exact question: how skewed is that number by routine, procedural votes or uncontested, ceremonial legislation?

Maybe it's not, but I'd want someone informed and statistically inclined enough to parse between those votes and highly contested legislation with starker party-line voting before giving him the benefit of the doubt.

3

u/FlyingBishop Jul 16 '26

That number only includes partisan votes. This information is not hard to look up. Just off the top of my head Fetterman has been holding the line against the SAVE act, he shows up.

4

u/13lackMagic Jul 16 '26

It explicitly does not include unanimous/heavily bipartisan resolutions

12

u/suburbanpride North Carolina Jul 16 '26

Just to be that guy… Assume we get a single seat majority in the Senate. Do you want Mr. 90% supporting the new D Senate Majority Leader? Or do you want him supporting Thune and keeping control of the Senate in R hands? It would be great to have a more staunchly progressive D in place of him, sure, but until we get the chance I can see an argument for keeping him onside.

18

u/Sennten Jul 16 '26

Give me a single reason to believe he'd support the D Senate Majority Leader at a 90% rate. Because hes been  pretty open about the fact that he wouldnt and is literally talking about that here and in other places. He has made it clear that if Dems were in the majority right now he would oppose nearly all their actual legislation and a bunch of their non legislative efforts - and thats with them still not having  the ability to actually put anything into law without compromising with Republicans first

1

u/FlyingBishop Jul 16 '26

On what? Fetterman has a clear set of policy positions. He's really about the best that we can hope for in Pennsylvania. If you want to change outcomes to favor left legislation this is not the seat to play games with.

2

u/imaginary_num6er Jul 16 '26

Let’s be real. Mainers will reliably vote against the wishes of the rest of the 49 states as seen by voting for a D president and a R senator in the same election. There will be no new D Senate Majority.

223

u/BakedBobbyHill Jul 15 '26

He's definitely not worth holding the rest of the party hostage.

35

u/WordWordNvmber Jul 16 '26

If he's the 51st vote for the next two years, yes he is.

9

u/themightychris Pennsylvania Jul 16 '26

Sir, this is the list! We must destroy ourselves and the country/world so we can post principled stands on Reddit

2

u/Gekokapowco Washington Jul 16 '26

in a situation where fetterman can be the 51st vote, he will not be

that's how people like him and manchin work, they play ball until the cards are down and their vote matters, then they will sabotage

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

[deleted]

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u/jankdangus Texas Jul 16 '26

What are you talking about? Why can’t you fathom the idea that’s just their genuine position? Biden’s agenda was not the status quo. He had actual policies that he wanted to accomplish, but simply didn’t have the votes to actually pass it.

1

u/FlyingBishop Jul 16 '26

Who are "they?" Fetterman replaced Pat Toomey who was a consistent vote for Republican judges. If we had Fetterman sooner we might not have lost the supreme court.

-1

u/WordWordNvmber Jul 16 '26

Who is "they," ma'am? Bernie Sanders and AOC? Because they're the ones who pushed Fetterman over the big bad Establishment's preferred pick, the popular (and sane!) Pittsburgh congressman Connor Lamb.

The slopulist wing of the progressive movement is basically the meme of the guy putting a stick in his bike.

4

u/Ill-Preparation-3598 Jul 16 '26

yea but fetterman DID change after the stroke.

-12

u/spazz720 Jul 15 '26

When he has he done that like Manchin though?

13

u/Electronic-Drive7348 Jul 15 '26

Wanna let him hang around long enough to suck Bibis
Tit?

5

u/Kell08 Pennsylvania Jul 16 '26

No, I voted for him in the 2018 and 2022 primaries and I intend to do the opposite in 2028. But it’s plainly better if, for the remainder of his term, he’s counted toward the democrats’ total number of senators and voting mostly against the republicans on partisan votes.

12

u/xXTheGrapenatorXx Canada Jul 16 '26

Right now, in the article we're commenting on.

2

u/spazz720 Jul 16 '26

What vote is he holding the Dems hostage in? They’re in the minority.

3

u/muzzey12 Jul 16 '26

Do you want to elaborate because he hasn't forced the party to do anything.

1

u/zzwugz Jul 16 '26

He's literally trying to force the party to support a foreign country by threatening to leave said party if they don't support that foreign country.

1

u/muzzey12 Jul 16 '26

Ok what vote did he hold the whole country hostage over. I can point to half a dozen than Manchin did.

1

u/zzwugz Jul 16 '26

1) that's shifting the goalposts

2) he said this in regards to the bill that was just voted on that gives billions in aid to Israel

3) Manchin also being an absolute piece of shit is irrelevant. No one here has defended Manchin

2

u/muzzey12 Jul 16 '26

No its not go up the comment chain I was responding to someone who said "When he has he done that like Manchin though?"

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u/Vrienchass Jul 15 '26

That's how I felt about Manchin, except no other Democrat could ever win that seat.

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u/UGMadness Europe Jul 15 '26

That's the difference between him and Manchin. Fetterman pretty much scammed his way to the Senate, any other Democrat could've won that seat against Dr. f*cking Oz.

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u/CaliOriginal Jul 16 '26

Just oz. He’s not a doctor anymore.

25

u/Content_Piccolo1074 Jul 16 '26

Downgraded back to wizard.

6

u/oTc_DragonZ Jul 16 '26

Except he definitely isn't wonderful

2

u/FlyingBishop Jul 16 '26

I would bet that a pro-Palestine Dem would've lost to Dr. Oz. You are dramatically overestimating PA.

-1

u/ButtEatingContest Jul 16 '26

Any other Democrat than Biden could have won the presidency in 2020, when voters were still mad at Trump over Covid.

And any other Democrat would not have picked Merrick Garland as attorney general.

1

u/Drachefly Pennsylvania Jul 16 '26

Clinton might not have won that

1

u/ButtEatingContest Jul 17 '26

Maybe not if she campaigned like 2016.

0

u/fcocyclone Iowa Jul 16 '26

I have contended for a long time that the only reason it was even as close as it was was because Biden wasn't a great campaigner.

30

u/yellekc Guam Jul 16 '26

I agree on Manchin, but Manchin and Fetterman are not the same, Manchin was the best we could get from West Virginia, it was him or some ultra MAGA. I hope that Fetterman is not the best we can get Pennsylvania.

3

u/JenkinsRobotButler Jul 16 '26

PA is a weird state. It has a mixture of everything. Rural PA is essentially like being in the deep south. Super racist and super conservative.

23

u/HippoRun23 Jul 16 '26 edited Jul 16 '26

So what’s he threatening then? To vote against them just because? Either way he’s a spineless monster mash.

17

u/Frozen_Esper Washington Jul 16 '26

Right... He would have to be threatening to completely change his stance on issues, meaning he doesn't actually have a stance. Useless.

8

u/xXTheGrapenatorXx Canada Jul 16 '26

He has one stance and it's "Israel needs more of our tax dollars", everything else must come second if he's willing to give it up in a floor crossing.

1

u/13lackMagic Jul 16 '26

He’s not threatening to “vote against them,” he’s saying he’d no longer have a (d) next to his name - in all likelihood he’d still caucus with the democrats, à la Bernie Sanders or Angus King

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '26

[deleted]

4

u/is_mr_clean_there Jul 16 '26

On top of this what he’s really saying is “I dont have any principles. I’ll change my stance on anything so long as people say they like me”

6

u/hexiron Jul 16 '26

So he votes with them only when his vote isn't needed to pass the ruling - at which point he can be trusted to support GOP whenever they need it.

8

u/Electronic-Drive7348 Jul 15 '26

Anyways. Lets grt a progressive in in his stead. CYA.

1

u/trevor5ever Jul 16 '26

If he is voting on principal and not along party lines, what difference would it make then?

1

u/SpeaksSouthern Jul 16 '26

The other 10% of the time he's voting for war

1

u/marr Jul 16 '26

What do you think his % will be if the party swings socialist?

1

u/disisathrowaway Jul 16 '26

Ok but how does he vote on the mission-critical stuff? Or appointments?

1

u/JcbAzPx Arizona Jul 16 '26

And what percentage of that "90%" mattered at all? My guess is zero.

1

u/ButtEatingContest Jul 16 '26

Yeah but the important stuff is all in that 10%.

1

u/angelar_ Texas Jul 16 '26

He can go vote with Dems 90% of the time with an R next to his name.

1

u/micro102 Jul 16 '26

Iirc, 90% is actually low. A lot of votes are about mundane things so many politicians have high rates of voting the same way as each other, regardless of their positions.

There used to be a website that showed %s of two politicians and how often they voted the same, but I can't find it.

3

u/cadium Jul 16 '26

I reject his framing, Democrats have no plans to "turn their back on israel".

1

u/raptorsango Jul 16 '26

We call that a Manchin

1

u/Early-Light-864 Jul 16 '26

That was my first thought. What would that look like exactly, and how is it different from now?

1

u/helix729 Jul 16 '26

Sounds like he voted in the same camp as democrats on 100% of the things he knew would NOT pass, and voted against them on the things that only needed another democrat in order to pass.