General
NTE Developers forget to remove AI watermark
In their newest update 1.3, a new area has been added, along with it came new fishing spots and fishing catches.
One of their fishing assets contains the watermark from Doubao (豆包) a popular Chinese AI chatbot assistant with image and video generation powered by Seedance (Bytedance).
This has sparked heated debate amongst Chinese players, while not hardly criticizing the use of AI they do make fun of the fact that Doubao’s AI image generation watermark comes from the free version of the app, with many comments calling them cheap, criticizing their carelessness and questioning the real reason behind their low production costs.
To quote one of the comments:
“AI is fine, but using Doubao is just funny. The free version no less.”
Other comments talk about AI across the Chinese gaming industry, how other companies such as Hoyoverse and Netease have self-developed AI tools while Hotta Studio uses an AI chatbot assistant.
To put it on perspective, asking Doubao to generate an image is very similar to asking ChatGPT.
Quote from another comment:
“Doubao Doubao, help me generate a game asset of a purple crowned seahorse.”
I’ll add that the Chinese community already knew about the extent of AI usage in Neverness to Everness, though they weren’t expecting to see Doubao of all things.
As of this post, the watermark has been removed with the asset remaining the same otherwise.
doesnt shock me, the global release of newest patch has half english half mandarin dialog options in the new area alternating every other word or two at the jetski dock
No one should be paying for these knowledge-stealing abominations anyway. Decades of free info on the net only for some corpo to lock them behind paywalls.
This is the future... most of us are going to be replaced in the workforce by cheapskate owners who won't even do the grace of replacing you with a paid version of AI.
No wonder the fishes' pictures suck so much, both in quality and consistency (especially the rosy barb's...): good thing i'm done forever with the fishing minigame, partially thanks to the latest event.
(And the less said about the fish tanks update, the better...)
People always praised the game for being low cost like half of Genshin's employees and half the cost, apparently. But of course with that little cost and manpower, they'd have to resort to AI to keep up the slack.
It's like the most obvious thing in the world ngl. The only way the game can be released this cheap is because of heavy AI usage. Being a game that costs cheap is not one of the points people need to keep being proud of.
No, they use AI to deliver more content without depth. They literally use the free AI version and don't even check the quality of their update before release. It's just complete lack of effort from the devs, but it has been like this since launch
"But of course with that little cost and manpower, they'd have to resort to AI to keep up the slack." Would say it's the opposite, they didn't use AI because they lacked manpower, they didn't hire many because they were using AI, they shoved it out speedily to capitalise on Ananta hype and AI helped massively to do that, it's clear from the start, early previews and character designs that AI was used in basically every step.
Well at least this time it's gonna shut the "devs listened" and "they're remorseful" crowd up and they totally won't pivot to "it's just background stuff" and "it's the intern" or Hoyo whataboutism
Yea, pumping out 5 week cycle while making dozens of new skins, vehicles while somehow keeping cost low with less employees than other companies is already a giant sign of using AI during production unless their workers somehow work 3 times more efficiently than other games which I doubt. The release and this just confirm that it's the case.
They literally never hid the fact that they use AI. They just claimed it’s background images or non-important assets, specifically trying to keep it vague on what they used AI for… but it was clear day 1 damn near any icon is AI and so is the text, not just background posters or whatever lol even the tree bark textures looked obviously AI.
Back when it first came out there was a whole thing with 1 of its fighting cutscenes too where the movements don't just seem jank, it legitimately looked like an AI was the choreographer
It's not about using AI, but about using AI in a sloppy way.
AI can produce quality content when it's post-processed by human artists, but then it doesn't save you nearly as much time or money. In fact, most CN game companies probably do use AI, but they don't make it obvious like NTE because they have robust post-processing pipelines that ensure, among other things, water marks are removed.
AI augmented content pipelines are pretty much an inevitability now with recent model developments. But not having human artists in the work flow will still result in slop, and this is what we're seeing.
Yep, they even had AI generated images of characters like Nanally/Mint (for ""placeholder"" banners). Which I don't buy because why tf would you GENERATE an image as a placeholder, which takes more time than you know, just USING AN IMAGE you already have from concept art as a ""placeholder""?
There's literally no reason to generate a new image to just use as a placeholder vs placing something there which you SHOULD have of characters you mde.
I don't particularly care about copyright shit but usually the license agreement doesn't allow the free version for commercial use. I checked and it does violate Doubao's user agreement.
Don't think so. I guess I should have said licensing not copyright but they're still using the software/website/service for commercial purposes which they're not supposed to be without a license
I don’t even like Makoto Shinkai, but morally, they should get sued or fined for that horrible AI poster referencing his movie. That's degrading considering Makoto Shinkai isn’t even an open AI apologist.
Using AI is one thing, but using it just to draw a seahorse? Really? There's lazy, there's 0 creativity (due to whatever reason), and then there's this
It's the lack of effort and quality control that is the most telling thing to me. Every asset intended for production is supposed to undergo rigorous review and pass approval before it even comes close to being deployed. You can only wonder what other corners they cut.
Every asset intended for production is supposed to undergo rigorous review and pass approval
Not really. Maybe in games that all about small polished patches like endfield, then yes, but NTE is kinda opposite. They give a lot of content but less polished
Not a fan of AI in creative industry myself, but the reality is, most people generally don't actually care or have enough knowledge on AI usage in video games. Just look at Shift Up for example.
Stellar Blade had AI usage in it and the CEO has also blatantly used AI to promote Stellar Blade: Blood Rain. Stellar Blade was still a success and I bet it will be the same for Blood Rain. Most people only care if the game is fun or not. Some countries like China is even all aboard on the AI train.
That Blood Rain music video got shit on because it looked terrible, Coca Cola’s AI Christmas ad got shit on because it looked like a fever dream, but Arc Raiders using AI for background NPC voices barely kicked up a fuss because it’s not really something that affects your experience.
Some countries like China is even all aboard on the AI train.
microdramas that used to employ people are now full on AI. script, voice, actors etc. and folks are a ok with that. thats all my boomer parents watch these days
Ding ding ding. And why should people care otherwise. Video games are a product designed to be fun. no one is playing NTE to walk around the city and blow up the textures and item icons 1000x and crtique them like those images are going to be revered like picaso's paintings lmao
The problem with Hotta/PW isn't really AI. AI is a symptom. The problem is that they have always been a quantity over quality developer. NTE is no different. AI naturally fits their development style in producing low-quality content.
If it wasn't AI, it would be Unreal Store assets or just outright copying assets like in Tower of Fantasy.
Spot on. They've always been a quantity over quality, and cut costs everywhere they can. Using the free version of a chatbot and not even bothering to remove the watermark is more of that, cutting corners and little quality control.
It would be one thing if they had their own AI fed with assets created in-house, but this? Just low effort to churn out content fast
This sums up my issue with the character designs as well, going all the way back to ToF. So many of the characters just feel like a mess because it’s just a bunch of shit slapped on + fan service. I still play NTE but I don’t really understand the amount of people that praise the character designs, they all just kinda look goofy and a hot mess
Agreed that most are a hot mess - but imo there are some simpler ones that just look good: Daffodil's city outfit is hands-down my favorite in this and most games i've played. A jacket, jeans and shirt with some patches - simple and works
similar imo with Nanally's default and school outfit, Lacrimosa's home design or Hotori's Orchid skin. They are simple and that simplicity is something alot of people really miss after the over-(even if well-)designed characters in Genshin, HSR or ZZZ
hella wish hotta would continue with those types of skins, not a fan of most designs after Shinku...
Yeah this is my real problem with NTEs AI use tbh. Like yea, I dont like AI use in my games, but the sloppily done and poorly edited (if at all) AI use like in NTE is what really drove me away from the game
The compounding issue is when the controversies around your game become talked about more than talk about your actual game.
NTE has had a rough start with the AI but AI is a symptom, the main issue is they lied to content creators they worked with who in turn told their audiences about said AI and that stuck in their minds more, what makes it worse is the breakdown of trust as said content creators were promised no AI only to find AI and if they lie about that, how could they trust them on other things like whether they will be properly compensated for their sponsorship/collab?
Then it cascades as collaborators who do work with them often have dim views on AI prior to NTE so to support or supported by NTE invites hypocrisy in addition to aforementioned risk on whether they get paid.
I mean it is and has been still obvious with things like this. The market screen image for that exact fishing mini game is the extremely obvious chibi ai artstyle. Basically every human on environment posters and standees is the generic ai anime artstyle.
Ya I quit long ago but looking at what you said it's obvious. This is what happens when your playerbase accepts AI usage (smtn smtn give someone an inch, they'll take a mile), it allows them to be lazy and cut cost on basically anything except the 3d model. Which I'm sure the only reason why Hotta isn't using them is because 3DAI generator isn't good enough.
Really, I’m less outraged by Hotta themselves because they are just opportunistic money grabbers. I’m mostly pissed by the NTE stans that overhype this mess and can tell you with a straight face "Hotta improved", while it take 5 minutes to understand it’s just the same mediocre slop than TOF.
I think AI is going to do a lot of damage to the creative industry and am worried about it in that sense, I understand that it is being integrated into tooling and what not very quickly, fine, I can't stop that. But blatant and lazy use of it has a really bad downstream perception on the game for me: if they're willing to be this lazy now with this, they're willing to cut corners on all other aspects of it which will hamper my enjoyment. That's a bummer because I have been enjoying it so far, but am increasingly nervous for its future. I did not play ToF but people have warned me.
companies will always do stuff in the company's interest: saving time (and money) on "irrelevant" stuff that doesn't make THEM money. Players can't spend money on the fishing event so why bother spending time in upholding it?
It's one thing to use AI and not give af but how cheap do you have to be to use free AI?
It makes no sense and when I mentioned in the NTE subreddit I got downvoted - but art and assets are often times the first thing done in a game and often times the first finished. There's hardly ever been a game delayed because the artists weren't finish arting. Art (whether it's concept, 3D modeling, etc.) often times is finished during the production phase -it's all finished before you get to anything post production.
They're cutting corners and being cheap on the cheapest and fastest part of doing the damn game.
AND ITS A GACHA GAME AT THAT - the art IS the productand is usually FINISHED before anything else. They're cheaping out on the actual PRODUCT
If you read the apology you'll realize they were always using AI assets in this game. Just not the "key components", apparently that was better in many of their eyes.
Many have put it succinctly. Hotta is a "quantity over quality" company. NTE has a LOT of content but you'll barely find much depth in it, nothing really is revolutionizing except that it's low cost open-world.
Also AI is everywhere in these big gamee. It's a matter of who hides it better here, in this case they don't even try. Such is the Hotta way.
I can't wait for the usual Hotta-shills in their main sub to equate this to another smear campaign by the WuWa comm tho. They're active here too so surely you all stop living in your own bubble now.
As a game developer, this is so embarassing and makes me not want to play the game despite having enjoyed it up til now. Gacha games rake in so much fucking money and to refuse to pay more for artists and make sure your team is actually creating the art used in the game is so half-assed. Really disappointed.
You can’t escape this slop basically every studio is being forced to have this trash. I’m just wondering how big the backlash for gta6 will be when everyone finds all the ai assets in that game when it drops
See, I don't even think it's that. It's just an easy thing people latch on as ammo for tribalism, "my game is better than your game" type shit. If it wasn't 50/50 it would have been something else, but 50/50 is the most distinguishing feature and low hanging fruit.
tell me something that makes you wanna play it aside from the gacha. If you go in NTE sub and ask why they play, they all say the gacha is the best first, it's literally the main reason people play NTE, not because the game is actually good
I do play this game and so far the most enjoyable part of the game were character interactions. The story is quite mid with continuity break that should be fixed in the next patch because if it doesn't then it would be the stupidest fucking plot hole in all of fiction. The combat is absolutely nothing special though some character kits seem pretty complex. The daily grind is super easy, like 5 minutes but that makes endgame also nonexistent and the hardest gamemode is barely hard, it's just level check. Overall the game is somewhat above average gacha but it certainly is on fraud watch.
They say everyone uses it but it really matters how. Are they using it to replace artists? Are they only using it for planning? Are they just testing the waters, does it give them ideas?
The worst part about AI is how vague people like to be about it (down to its very name, cus it's genAI but it's labelled as just AI) so that you either have to accept all of it or accept none of it
Have you read the Chinese comments, they are making fun of them having no in house AI like the bigger studios. Unlike us Western who stupidly believe "the game I play doesn't use AI." They know all of them use AI...
In China, they don't judge the use of AI but if it affects their gaming experience, they'll screw you over just like anyone else. NTE, in particular has hundreds of bug complaints in each patch, leading many Chinese players to believe that devs're being used them as a test server for Global. Now, AI is back in the spotlight, making them suspect that AI is being used to program the game code, which is why they have to deal with so many bugs.
Which is probably the case since I saw some global NTE fans saying shits like: "This is why Im glad we have a 1 week delay, so devs and chinese players can spot bugs and optimize the game better"
Never have I seen such a fanbase that has people blatantly defends such horrific QC. Let's see how they like that when CN peeps say goodbye to the game due to feeling mistreated and global will have to taste the bugs themselves.
This is assuming they haven't already lmao. From an initial milquetoast reception on CN from the quality, you can definitely see they dislike being treated as open beta testers every single patch. Their banners just don't do well in China - even when mobile is a secondary market, it just doesn't paint a good picture overall.
This recent "main push" being embroiled in a cuckoldry scandal + a myriad of 1.3 launch bugs, CN is just not happy.
It doesn't help that NTE is under pressure for constant bugs and the recent storyline, so their blatant and unsubtle AI use just becomes another point against them
NTE has poor quality control over their updates, and this AI watermark just proves it. I don't mind the use of AI in games, but make it high quality and show to players you actually care. NTE doesn't have any of that but yet people like to eat shit
Shinku being able to infinite sprint by activating her dragon form (which sprints by default) and just using the walk button instead of the run button (so the sprint only uses the stamina that walking does) didn't clue you in that they skimp on QA?
Most game companies, even small ones or ones that outsource, use local generation. And most of those local generative models are from China anyway. So how lazy can you be, and how bad is your QC, to screw up something this basic?
I'm not surprised, this game has a quality issue, and based on actions such as this it doesn't look like they are addressing it. Half baked, half assed, and rushed out the door.
People will deadass go “I know it has problems but I still like playing it” as though they aren’t literal pigs in slop devaluing humanity.
You have a moral obligation to carry yourself with dignity. If you want to act like an animal and diminish your standards for your own pleasure, you shouldn’t expected to be seen as a human. Not too difficult to understand.
For a drawing of a seahorse even. I mean, did their art team are that lazy to be unable to make even an interesting seahorse? Like I'm no artist but surely drawing a seahorse isn't in a realm of "I need some creative breakthrough for this"
Imagine spending hundreds on a live service game and they cant even afford real artists.
Truly the McDonalds of Gacha, but theres a reason why mcdonalds is one of the highest valued stock i guess: so if you like mcdonalds you have good taste!
They got a lot of money from this game I wonder how the money go to ? since the Weathering with You ai poster drama they still using ai like beginner level which look cheap and flawed that a lot of people noticed easily lol.
I mean.....since when does money saved from AI ever go back into the game? It usually just goes into the stockholders' pockets like usual. Businessess being businessess like usual
Now I don't play NTE and have no idea what's in this patch but this is funny af.
NTE players seriously need to step up their money game, Hotta can't even be bothered to have an in-house AI and instead uses a third-party AI on its free version no less lmao. Small indie company btw.
Chinese community clowns the low quality of the game itself before discussing AI specifically. People here are too hyper-focused on the AI usage. If the game used AI and it was high-quality, then netizen rants wouldn't matter.
using AI makes a game bad automatically because devs or higherups that don't care enough to pay artists or writers will always produce bad content actually
Didn’t they make a grand statement about them not using AI anymore onwards ? Their AI usage is obvious but it really irks me that people outright lies to their costumers, still manage to earn money. It’s even worst when NTE stans will gobble it up because the game is cheaper with no 50/50, because it would magically justify ALL the griefs found with this game.
No wonder all the English voice acting sounds robotic for every character except Iroi and Adler, I’m on the verge of quitting because the audio/personalities/combat are not my cup of tea
You would think they would have enough money to just pay for it. Like sure use gen ai if you want but leaving a watermark like that shows how much you care less about the game or maybe they were in a rush?
Guys, just chill, this is totally normal. Keep in mind that every character in NTE is AI-generated anyway, so of course they're gonna use AI for minor stuff like this. They just don't want to hire real artists
As expected from Hotta Studio, seemingly everyone forgot that they stole weapon assets from Honkai Impact 3rd, a move set from the same game and the saint quartz design from F/GO (literally just recolored it purple for limited event currency) also an MV made by an indie animator, all for Tower of Fantasy, the chinese gacha community back then massively labeled the game as "Tower of Theft", their reviews were boted and some included the name "Yoimiya", it's been five years since then and they continue to cheapen out for fun, even for their big release, it's deplorable.
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u/LetMetOucHyOURasS 14d ago
Not even using the paid version is very funny.